The game was swept through COVID-19. Now, the pandemic is expected to overturn school football, as multiple meetings attract their groups by the fall. Sports editor Dave Zirin and retired NFL defensive finale and activist Michael Bennett co-wrote the ebook “Things That Uncomfortable Whites.” They sign up for Hari Sreenivasan to talk about Black Lives Matter and the long term of the game.
NOW THE SPORT HAS BEEN ABANDONED BY COVID.
COULD PANDEMIC CANCEL AMERICAN COLLEGE FOOTBALL?
THE BIG 10, PAC-12 AND MOUNTAIN WEST ARE THE BIG CONFERENCES THAT ARE THE TEAMS OF THEIR FALL.
SPORTS WRITER DAVE ZURIN AND MICHAEL BENNETT CO-AUTHORIZED “THE THINGS THAT MAKE WHITES INEVITABLE.”
HERE WE TALK ABOUT EMPOWERING ATHLETES COLLEGIATE BY THE BLACK LIFE MOVEMENT AND DEMANDING THEIR SAFETY BEFORE THE HASHTAG WE ARE UNITED AND WANT TO PLAY.
THIS SEEMS LIKE AN INTERSECTION OF SO MANY THINGS HAPPENING RIGHT NOW.
WE HAVE FEMALE STUDENTS IN THEIR LONG-RUNNING STRUGGLES, WE HAVE A PANDEMIC, WE HAVE A BLACK LIFE THAT COUNTS, WE HAVE LEFT SCHOOLS, AND THAT’S WHY I WANTED THIS CONVERSATION WITH YOU, BECAUSE YOU’RE PASSING WITH UNIVERSITY FOOTBALL SEPARATED US A DOOR TO SO MANY OTHER INTERESTING THINGS.
Let me start with that.
DAVE, HAVE YOU EVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE THIS WHERE STUDENTS HAVE SUCCESSFULLY FILED A LAWSUIT ON THEIR OWN STREET, OR IN A FEW WEEKS WE’VE ACTUALLY SEEN AN ACTION THAT IMPACTS THEIR LIFE AND COLLEGE CAREER?
YOU SHOULD GO BACK TO THE LATE 1960S, WHEN YOU HAVE A PERIOD OF BLACK ATHLETE REVOLUTION, WHEN MANY BLACK STUDENT ATHLETES, AS THEY ARE CALLED, THOUGH I HAVE PROBLEMS WITH THE STUDENT ATHLETE PHRASE, AS WE CAN ARGUE, BUT MANY OF THEM HAVE BEEN AGAINST RACIST COACHES, AGAINST NOT HAVING BLACK CHEERLEADERS, EVEN IF I CANNOT CHOOSE THEIR OWN CLASSES.
THERE WAS A WAVE OF THAT IN THE LATE 1960S AND EARLY 1970S BY ATHLETES LICENSED BY THE BLACK FIGHT.
MANY OF THESE ATHLETES FEEL EMPOWERED BY THE BLACK LIFE MOVEMENT THAT COUNTS TO REALLY TALK ABOUT THEIR OWN.
IT’S NOT JUST THE PANDEMIC.
HE SEES PEOPLE ON THE STREETS CALLING FOR RACIAL JUSTICE, APPLIED TO THEIR OWN LIVES.
MICHAEL, I WANT YOU TO TAKE US BACK, IF YOU CAN.
WHEN YOU PLAY IN TEXAS AM, COULD YOU IMAGINE A STUDENT MOMENT THAT SAYS, LISTEN, I WANT SCHOLARSHIP PROTECTION, I WANT THE MEDICAL COSTS ASSOCIATED WITH THIS PANDEMIC, YOU KNOW, I’M NOT THAT YOUR ENTERTAINMENT, I’M A HUMAN BEING?
HAS THIS POWER DYNAMIC CHANGED IN A LITTLE WHILE YOU’RE AT SCHOOL AND TODAY?
NO, I COULDN’T IMAGINE.
I FEEL BEFORE THAT THERE WAS A LOT OF FEAR.
WE CAN’T GET COLIN KAEPERNICK TO TAKE A KNEE.
WE DON’T HAVE THIS MOMENT TO CLIMB UP THE MAXIMUM TO PUSH EVERYONE OVER THE EDGE.
PEOPLE HAVE BEEN SUBJECTED TO A LOT OF THINGS.
I DON’T THINK WE HAVE THE COURAGE TO COME TOGETHER COLLECTIVELY ALMOST, IN A SENSE, AND REALLY WHAT WE WANT, IGNORING THAT WE’VE BEEN THE ONES WHO BRING INCOME TO SCHOOL AND WE KNOW THE THINGS THAT WE FACE THE BUSINESS, AS DAVID TALKS ABOUT BEING ABLE TO CHOOSE HIS CLASS AND NOT BE PUSHED IN A CERTAIN WAY.
AND SEE THAT THEY FINALLY MEET EVERYONE AND CHALLENGE THE NCAA IN THEIR STATE, KNOW HOW IT WAS THE ABILITY TO BENEFIT AND ENJOY AMATEUR ATHLETES, AND KNOW THAT ALMOST EVERYONE, YOU KNOW, PUT THEM IN A SITUATION WHERE THEY HAVE TO MANAGE PAIN AND ALL THEIR LIFE, A CONTINUATION AFTER FINISHING THE SPORT.
I THINK ANY CONTRACT YOU SIGN PERPETUITY IS A DANGEROUS CONTRACT.
DAVE, THERE ARE TWO SEPARATE HASHTAGS THAT SEEM TO BE POPPING UP.
In a way, academics have completed everything the rest of the country has.
THERE WAS THE HASHTAG WE ARE UNITED, AND THE ONE WE WANT TO PLAY, AND FOR A WHILE, THOSE WERE ALMOST CLOSED.
WE WALK THROUGH WHAT HAPPENED.
TWO OF THE FIVE MAIN CONFERENCES HAVE SAID WE WON’T BE PLAYING FOOTBALL THIS FALL.
WHAT MANY ATHLETES WHO SAID WERE AGITATED, WE NEED TO UNITE.
WE NEED TO UNIONIZE.
WE NEED A STATEMENT ABOUT OUR HEALTH CARE, HOW WE ARE TREATED IN THIS PANDEMIC.
THAT’S CHANGED.
THEY STARTED SAYING LIKE, WAIT A MINUTE, WE REALLY WANT TO PLAY, THINKING.
WE WANT TO BE ABLE TO HAVE AN ADDRESS WHERE THIS GAME COMES FROM.
THE PROBLEM, ALTHOUGH THEY HAVE NO ASSOCIATION OF PLAYERS.
THE PROBLEM IS THAT THERE IS NO CENTRALIZED UNI LEADERSHIP, AS A COMMISSIONER LIKE YOU HAVE IN THE NFL OR THE NBA.
So there’s nothing genuine to organize and get what those college athletes deserve.
INSTEAD, WHAT YOU WERE ADVANCING WAS DIFFERENT CONFERENCES AGAINST OTHERS, DIFFERENT MEDICAL EXPERTS LOOK AT DIFFERENT TIMES, SAYING WHAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO HEAR OPEN OR NOT OPEN.
HE HAS MANY ATTORNEYS INVOLVED IN THE LIABILITY ISSUE.
BEFORE YOU MET HIM, YOU HAD A GOOD PART OF THE FOOTBALL SEASON IN COLLEGE, OF THIS RECORD, ONLY COMPLETELY IN SMOKE.
MICHAEL, TELLS US what this last year of play can be like.
I WANT, IN THIS CONTEXT, IT SEEMS THAT IF YOU ARE IN THE BUBBLE OR A GOOD PLAYER, THIS COULD DETERMINE THE LOCATION IN THE PROJECT AT THE HEIGHT YOU ARE SELECTED, HOW MUCH MONEY YOU COULD GET A SIGNING BONUS.
ALTERNATIVELY, THE POTENTIAL IS FOR YOUR HEALTH TO COME FROM THE SAME VIRUS OR THE HEALTH OF ONE OF YOUR ASSETS.
HOW HARD IS IT FOR A PLAYER TO HANDLE THIS?
I think it’s a complicated decision.
HE HAS THE DUALITY OF WANTING TO ACHIEVE SOMETHING AT A HIGH LEVEL AND DUALITY OF BEING AN ATHLETIC STUDENT AND DOING HEALTH MANAGEMENT.
HE’S IN A MEETING, BECAUSE HE DOESN’T REALLY KNOW WHAT TO DO.
AS AN ATHLETE STUDENT IN THE LAST YEAR OF YOUR UNIVERSITY, IT IS VERY IMPORTANT TO PUT YOURSELF IN A POSITION OF BEING IN THE HEADSET.
THIS IS BIGGER THAN THAT.
IT’S TIME TO EXPECT A STUDENT-ATHLETE TO BE IN THE BUBBLE BURSTING, AND I THINK IT IS – SOME ATHLETES FIND IT – BUT AT THIS POINT THE BIGGEST THING IS WHAT WOULD BE BETTER FOR MANY YOUNG ATHLETES ENTERING THE UNIVERSITY LEVEL.
DAVE, YOU CALLED THE COLLEGE FOOTBALL SYSTEM A PLANTING SYSTEM.
WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY THAT?
GOOD, BECAUSE I FEEL IT WAS ORGANIZED FOR A GENERATION AT LEAST ON THE BASIS OF THE SYSTEMATIC EXPLOITATION OF MAINLY BLACK ATHLETES.
IT HAS – THERE IS A GREAT SOUND OF ASPIRATION IN COLLEGE FOOTBALL THAT INVOLVES TAKING THE BLACK WEALTH THAT IS CREATED, PUTTING IT IN THE POCKETS OF ADMINISTRATORS, COACHES, WHITE PRIMARY ADMINISTRATORS OF THE GAME.
COLLEGE FOOTBALL, RECOVERY, IS THE SECOND MOST PROFITABLE AND MOST POPULAR SPORT IN THE UNITED STATES.
NFL IS THE ONLY SPORT BEHIND IT IN TERMS OF RATING AND MONEY.
THERE ARE CURRENTLY A BILLION TELEVISION CONTRACTS FOR BROADCAST COLLEGE FOOTBALL.
COLLEGE FOOTBALL COACHES ARE THE HIGHEST-PAID STATE EMPLOYEES I THINK IT’S 39 OUT OF THE 50 STATES.
HE IS THE STATE FOOTBALL COACH WHO IS THE HIGHEST PUBLIC EMPLOYEE AND TO MAKE IT EVEN MORE STAR, AS PEOPLE UNDERSTAND, WHEN CLEMSON WON THE NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP IN 1981, A COACH WON $50,000 A YEAR.
COACH NOW, DABBO SWEENEY, EARNS $10 MILLION A YEAR.
IT’S WHEN I PUT IT IN AS A PLANTATION SYSTEM, IT’S A SYSTEM IN WHICH ATHLETES AREN’T PAID FOR THE WORK THEY PUT IN.
IT IS NO COINCIDENCE TO ME THAT THE MOST EXPLOITATIVE SPORT IS ABSOLUTELY DEPENDENT ON BLACK BODIES FOR PROFITABILITY.
MICHAEL, YOU KNOW, YOU’VE HEARD THE FAMILIAR ABSTENTION OF THE NCAA, LISTEN AND DAVE REFERENCIÓ HERE, THAT YOU GET AN EDUCATION, THEY ARE ALWAYS AMATEURS, CHANGES THE DYNAMICS IF YOU GET PAID.
SHOULD UNIVERSITY ATHLETES BE COMPENSATED?
SHOULD THEY BE ABLE TO JOIN?
I WANT THAT IF WE TAKE AWAY ONLY FROM CAPITALISM AND A FAIR DEAL, IT IS IF YOU GET A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF SUCCESS, YOU BRING A LOT OF MONEY TO YOUR BUSINESS, THEN YOU HAVE A STOCK OPTION, YOU HAVE DIVIDENDS OF CERTAIN TYPES OF SKILL.
AS A COLLEGE ATHLETE, THEY MUST BE PAID.
YOU LOOK AT A LOT OF COLLEGE – GO TO JOHNNY MANZIEL, YOUR SWEATER SELLS WITH YOUR NAME, WE GO BACK TO CAM NEWTON, ALL THESE GREAT ATHLETES GO TO THE NFL WHEN THEIR JERSEY WAS SOLD IN MANY DIFFERENT WAYS, AND THE UNIVERSITY HAS BENEFITED FROM THEIR NAMES AND BENEFITS FROM DOCUMENTS AND BENEFITS OF THEM – IT HAS COLLEGE ATHLETES WHO CAN’T EVEN EAT WITH THEIR NUMBER ONE IN PROSPECT , BUT THE ATHLETE IS TRAPPED IN A SITUATION BUT CANNOT REACH ANY MONEY FOR THEIR SERVICE.
IF YOU LOOK AT THE GRADE, IT DEPENDS ON THE GRADE YOU HAVE, YOU KNOW – THE DEGREE OF A HIGH SCHOOL IS NOT WORTH MUCH THESE DAYS.
IF THE UNIVERSITY ATHLETE CANNOT BENEFIT FROM YOUR SKILLS, WHAT IS YOUR BRAND, WHAT IS YOUR BODY, WHAT IS YOUR BODY, THAT THE UNIVERSITY USES IT, WHAT ELSE DOES IT DO?
YOU HAVE THAT GRADE, BUT IT IS NOT THE VALUE OF THE PAPER ON WHICH IT IS PRINTED.
MICHAEL, I WANT TO PLAY THE NFL, TOO.
SINCE THE TRAINING CAMP STARTED, SOMEWHERE 60 – I THINK LAST WEEK’S PLAYERS ARE ALREADY TESTING POSITIVES WITH THIS VIRUS.
YOU’VE PLAYED A POSITION, A DEFENSIVE ENDING, YOU’RE LITERALLY FACE TO FACE WITH A GUY WHO – I MEAN, YOU’RE FIGHTING.
YES, HE GETS A LOT OF HALITOSIS COMING BACK TO YOU.
IS THERE ANY WAY TO PLAY SPORT SAFELY EVEN – WHAT KIND OF TEST REGIME?
HOW CAN YOU PLAY THIS CLOSE CONTACT, INCREDIBLY A PHYSICAL SPORT WHERE YOU EXERCISE SO MUCH ENERGY SAFELY?
Honestly, I think of this idea of playing this sport for sure, and I think that when you look at Donald Trump and the way he was able, you know, to articulate a message around, you know, capitalism about the morality of citizens, I think it was opening up MANY OF THOSE WORKS AND A LOT OF THIS BACKING UP OF MANY CITIZENS, REALIZING THAT MANY OF THESE COMPANIES AND MANY THINGS THAT AMAN DO NOT SHARE THE SAME AMOUNT OF LOVE.
WE ASK TO ROMANTICIZE WITH OUR OCCUPATION AND WHAT I LOVE ABOUT MY WORK AND HE LOVES ME IN THE SAME WAY AND AT LEAST NAKED, THE MOST IMPORTANT OF ALL WAS ALWAYS MAKING MONEY.
I THINK IT WILL BE DIFFICULT TO FIND A SAFE WAY AND NOT ALLOW ANY PLAYER TO GET THE VIRUS.
AT THE SAME TIME, WE KNOW IT’S VIRAL.
WE KNOW THE NFL SPORT YOU NEED TO PLAY.
I DON’T KNOW IF THERE IS – IF IT’S POSSIBLE TO LEAVE A WHOLE SEASON AND NOT, YOU KNOW, SPREAD THE VIRUS.
I ALSO WANT TO ASK YOU WHAT TIME WE ARE NOW.
YOU PLAY AT A TIME WHEN PLAYERS INCLUDE COLIN KAEPERNICK AND YOU HERE WE ARE NOW, YOU HAVE ALL THE KNEE TEAM.
YOU SEE REFEREES, PLAYERS TRAIN TO DO IT, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN TO YOU?
I’m worried about symbolism, I’m worried about symbolism, other people see it as the number one purpose to progress and I think we should be careful not to be part of the moment.
IT’S MORE RISK, BECAUSE IT WASN’T THE POPULAR THING TO DO IN A CULTURE, YOU KNOW, OR THINGS SEEM INSTANTANEOUS, BUT I THINK YOU KNOW WE HAVE TO WAIT TO SEE HOW LONG, TIME AND STRONG THESE SYMBOLS MEAN.
WE HAVE A LOT OF THESE OWNERS AND TEAMS BUT THERE’S A DEPTH – THROUGH WHICH THEY’RE CONNECTED, WE’LL SEE SUPPORT – A LOT OF THINGS WE DON’T WANT TO SEE I THINK WE NEED TO BE HONEST AND RECOGNIZE WITH TRUST, AND WHAT THEY DO, AND THAT WE’RE REALLY TRYING TO FIND A WAY TO BE A PART OF THIS ASSOCIATED WORLD, I THINK THAT’S WHAT WE NEED TO TAKE CARE OF ONLY BY THE MEANS , BUT BEING ABLE TO HAVE AN HONEST CONVERSATION WITH THE PLAYERS, DO YOU HAVE AN HONEST CONVERSATION ABOUT WHY IT TOOK SO LONG?
I THINK THERE’S A SENSE OF RELATIONSHIP, ESPECIALLY WHEN IT COMES TO BLACK LIFE.
YOU SHOULD REMEMBER THAT THE GOAL WAS NEVER TO BE ENTITLED TO KNEEL OR SIT DURING THE HYMN.
THE GOAL WAS NEVER TO HAVE A FREE SPEECH DURING THE HYMN.
THAT’S NOT WHAT IT’S ALL ABOUT.
THIS IS POLICE REFORM.
WHAT THE CONCERN IS THAT, WHEN THE WHOLE GOAL IS ABOUT WHAT NBA PLAYERS ARE DOING DURING THE ANTHEM AND WHAT IT’S NOT, IT BECOMES BASIC, ALMOST A TOOL AND NOT SOMETHING STRAIGHT TO A PARTICULAR MOTION GOAL, WHICH IS THE BEGINNING.
DAVID, I’M SURE YOU’RE NOT SURPRISED WHEN YOU SEE THE PRESIDENT TALKING ABOUT LOW PROBABILITIES FOR THE NBA, IT’S BECAUSE OF ACTIVISM.
I WANT IT TO BE PART OF A MODEL OF HOW SPORT HAS BEEN USED IN RECENT YEARS.
YES, I THOUGHT PRESIDENT TRUMP, THE MOST DISCIPLINED PART OF ANY OF HIS PRESIDENCY, HAS BEEN THROWING RACIAL ANIMUS THROUGH THE SPORT, OR YOU WANT TO CALL IT A WHEEZING RACIAL DOG, RACISM, WHATEVER IS SEIZED, IS CONSTANTLY SPAM THE NFL AND THE NBA BLACK, AS A PLACE TO STEP ON ITS BASE.
He said NBA ratings are bad.
THEY DON’T DO A GREAT JOB LIKE HOCKEY.
YOU DON’T HAVE TO BE AT SHARPTON TO KNOW WHAT YOU’RE SAYING, AND THE NBA RANKING IS THREE TIMES HIGHER THAN THE HOCKEY RANKINGS.
WHEN DID YOU DIVULG THE FACTS ALONG THE WAY?
THE POINT IS TO USE PLAYERS AS A BASIS FOR A DISTRACTION FOR PEOPLE AS A MEANS – SO IT’S LIKE NOT SEEING THE PANDEMIC, NOT LOOKING AT THE DIVISION OF THE COUNTRY, NOT LOOKING AT HOW MUCH PAIN THERE IS, BLAMES THOSE RICH ATHLETES WHO DON’T APPRECIATE THE GREAT COUNTRY IT IS.
MICHAEL, WHY DO YOU THINK SPORT IS SO SOLICITOR FOR ALL THESE DIFFERENT TYPES OF CULTURAL WARS WE HAVE?
I mean, with one hand, which is very undeniable to inspire your team, wear the colors, the jersey, the tailgate, in short, have a good time.
ALL OF A SUDDEN NOW, IT SEEMS THAT YOUR SUPPORT FOR THE TEAM OR A SPECIFIC PLAYER OR A LEAGUE, IS A POLITICAL STATEMENT IN ITSELF.
I THINK WE’RE LIVING IN A POLITICAL WORLD RIGHT NOW, A LOT OF THINGS ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE TREATMENT POLICY FOR MEN THAT LOOKS AT RACIAL DISPARITIES DURING THE COVID HE SHOWED.
I think a lot of times teams and players are starting to get humanity back.
IT’S ALWAYS A SENSE OF THAT SUBHUMANISM WHEN YOU’RE AN ATHLETE.
YOU ARE PART OF THIS CLASS THAT DOES NOT KNOW IT, YOU DO NOT KNOW, DOES NOT ASSOCIATE WITH ALL THESE DIFFERENT THINGS, AND NOW ATHLETES HAVE THAT AWAKENING.
I THINK THE WHOLE WORLD IS AWAKENING IN ITS RESPONSIBILITY TO THE CITIZEN.
WHEN HE LOOKS AT AN ATHLETE, HE LIKES THAT HE IS NOT PART OF A SYSTEM, BUT IS PART OF IT.
WHEN AN ATHLETE REPLENISHES, YOU LOOK AT COLIN KAEPERNICK AND WHAT IT DOES, MANY PEOPLE DETITAN WHAT IT DOES, WHAT THEY HAVE Assumed Brought Sport, Politics and Faith to All Those Other Things, but Why on Our Back Floor – and OTHER People SEE US
I THINK ABOUT WHEN WE TALK ABOUT OUR POLITICAL VIEWS THAT RELATE TO THE HUMAN SIDE.
I THINK IT’S IMPORTANT AS AN ATHLETE TO RECOGNIZE THESE THINGS, RECOGNIZE THE RESPONSIBILITY TO BE ABLE TO SPEAK, RECOGNIZE THE RESPONSIBILITY TO REALLY BE A FULL CITIZEN, YOU KNOW?
ALL RIGHT, THANK YOU BOTH.
Thank you.
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– Anderson Family Fund, Sue and Edgar Wachenheim, III, Candace King Weir, the Cheryl and Philip Milstein family, the Leila and Mickey Straus Family Foundation, Bernard and Denise Schwartz, Charles Rosenblum, Jeffrey Katz and Beth Rogers, Jim Attwood and Leslie Williams and the JPB Foundation.